Moho Forum

the eyes are the window to the soul, and the eyebrows the frames... or some old nonsense..
eyebrows and eye shape will give you loads of expression.

I finished the girl character. I still have some adjustments to make including the line weights. But I think I have the shape finalized. Still hoping I won't have to add eyebrows. :-\

Here's a sync test doing a cheesy imitation (I think we'll voice her very differently, though!):
http://vimeo.com/10398920

I tried to get some expression in the eyes with subtle shape changes through actions. But this is such a placid sync test, that it didn't really give me a chance to test the limits of expressiveness.

In my past sync tests, I've left the body still. I tried moving it a little here and it looks very jerky. Has anyone tried point motion with actions for this?

Watched all the animation tests. Looks really good man. I like the style and colours a lot.

Didn't realize you had some skillz. This is one of the most appealing things I've seen on these forums. The first is a short called Neo-Mickey also on Vimeo.

What's your thing for choosing the coloured outline? Is it one dark colour for the whole body? I've been using a colour palette someone gave me for years now. I like your colours.

The style's also reminiscent of one of my all-time favourite video games Parappa the Rapper.

I like the flatness (although I try to stuff every corner with textures in my own work). It reminds me on a certain graphical style I've seen lots of examples of recently: coloured outlines, subdued colours, no shades, uniform line width, reduced details. Something like the characters on those instruction charts on airplanes and the like.

I found some really great examples of having a very disturbing content delivered in this very clean and neutral manner, which adds much to the fun. This could work the same way in your animation: have an interesting story with "big action", but let the characters stay really calm about it. "Yeah, reckon he's dead." Pause. "Maybe we should do something about this." Looong pause. This could be very funny when perfectly done ...

There's not much movement in the examples. I like the girl's head turn, just leave it that way. I'm still not convinced about the eyes. For me, those bright eyes in a darker face have a hostile expression.

As for expression, I'd like to see some more body motion while talking. Give them some gestures, that makes a big difference. Test some weight shifting movement - you know, from one leg to the other, this always gives a distinct movement of the shoulders. It will be difficult to have the character's upper body tilt backwards and forwards when seen (mostly) from the front, but it will be worth the effort. It's all about subtlety - sometimes you move a line just some pixels, but it will mean a lot.

Okse, ChristopherJD, and Slowtiger--Thanks for the suggestion of eyebrows! I really like how expressive eyebrow animation can be. And I want the characters to have that expressive capacity. Here's a drawing with some eyebrows. I feel like she looks totally different, but I may be too used to her without eyebrows. However, I often look at my own eyebrows and think they look funny. When I start thinking about them too much, they dominate everything I see.

[edit: images removed]

Mikdog--Wow, I really appreciate your encouragement. I've already lost steam on this project many times. The original idea is years old, but my friends and I gave up on it without ever getting anywhere because it was hard. lol So this time I'm trying to adjust my expectations and just try to create something that I love, even if it's very short.

I have seen Neo-Mickey here in the forum during my lurking days. It had a very nice feeling to it. And I do remember that you were very fond of it! I have seen a lot of really inspiring work here. Happy Land is one of my personal inspirations. So your encouragement means a lot!

The outlines are all a dark, muted brown. I have collected some favorite color combinations that evoke a distinct feeling for me. You are more than welcome to use them. I haven't tried to create an actual palette before, but now I think I might. Some of these are favorite combinations that I always come back to and others are only in the mix for the sake of variety. And the colors are just for a general idea. I would adjust them slightly for actual use. Like the third one (inspired by the whiskey sour and mustard containers) should be more of a tomato red. I also need to update this because I have a lot more of these in my mind.

You can put me in the "no eyebrows" camp. I like the austerity of the design, and I think the eyebrows take away from that...your animation test conveyed plenty of emotion just through eye shape.

I do like the eyebrows look...but I like the "no eyebrows" more!

Slowtiger--Thanks! I like the idea of juxtaposing the content with the art style. And the humor you describe sounds similar to what we're going for. I'll have to keep timing in mind.

Yep, I was working on the eyes last night and getting disoriented looking at them. I thought it was from lack of sleep, but I think you nailed it as being a contrast issue. I'll definitely look into that. Although, I'm glad she has a hostile look because that's part of her character. :D

Thanks for the advice on motion! I've got a lot to learn about about animation and these subtle movements are the toughest. Hopefully I can reuse things like shifting weight over and over.

I try to avoid giving specific suggestions about character design since I believe you know what style you're after. However, it's useful to know how easy it is to read your character's type purely on visuals, eg., "dandy", "ice queen", "emo guy", "punk", etc.

Adding eyebrows would make it easier to sell certain expressions, BUT I wouldn't add them if it will ruin the look you're after. You can convey emotion through good posing, etc. Along the same lines, your characters have small pupils, which tend to make the characters look aloof, dazed or hostile, even. You COULD make them bigger so they look more cute or likable, but again I have a feeling this isn't the look you're after.

Of course, you could add eyebrows, bigger pupils, etc. to good effect for just a few frames for those double-take or anticipation shots

Anyway, just few thoughts to chew over. I personally like the designs as they are. I'm looking forward to seeing the stories you have for these characters.

Funny, I find myself on the "no eyebrows" side. They look younger this way, and I think it's a challenge and a good change from that old cliché of Anime with all their eyebrows staring into camera ...

As for mimics, I forgot to mention that you should try to move the face outline as well as the mouth. Just a subtle hint of moving cheeks will make such a difference! Also have a look in the mirror and see how much a broad smile also changes the shape of the eyes.

Thanks for opinions on eyebrows! I'm definitely leaning away from them after seeing them. They just look weird to me. Reminds me of the show Daria, though. :)

Neeters guy, I think you're right that good posing will play a big role in conveying emotion successfully. That's an area where I'll need to practice.

I really like the idea to bring in bigger pupils for certain scenes. It's especially useful because viewers won't be conscious of the change, but will just get a different feeling from the scene. I think another thing about the pupils is that they are not really round when the outlines are visible. The squarish look might be adding to the jarring effect. I'll adjust those and see if it makes a difference.

Thanks Slowtiger for the suggestion to include facial movement in the lip syncing. You were right -- it does make a world of difference: [EDIT: video link removed. (The neck problems were driving me crazy.)] Some of the phoneme face shapes may need adjustment. I was just guessing and looking in the mirror a bit when I created them. But overall, I love the effect. That's exactly the feeling I wanted.

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[edit: image removed]


And some clothing tests.

Really nice design.
Hope you don't mind but a few points that came to me. Getting rid of these tangents will make your poses read clearly. The neck is exaggerated for clarity, hope it makes sense. Only other comment would be to try be more solid with the eyes. Pupils in nowhere land can often leave a character looking spaced out or dead looking.

Lovely work though Iwaxana.

Jez

I vote for no eyebrows too, they somehow look too intense and mess up the face.

For the clothing for the guy I think your first collar worked really well.

Yes, that dialogue is definitely an improvement! (I like it to be right ...)

And knunk is absolutely right about avoiding those tangents.

Nice lip-synch test. Looks really good. Though you may want to put the HEAD and NECK in a GROUP (NECK_HEAD or something) and set the pivot point to the bottom centre of the neck. That way the neck won't move along the shoulder line when the head tilts forward, and you can still move the head independently on the neck.

About the eyebrows. Use them when needed if it gives the expression you are looking for. I don't think its a (yes or no) situation. If you feel that they will help with a close up to help show anger and not use them for other scenes.