Moho Forum

left at Albuquerque: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8TUwHTfOOU

Hello Heyvern,

My clock finally worked smoothly!
I believe that I can understand your theory now.
I am also able to know a meaning of "This is sheer genius, Vern!" that Danimal said when just after you posted up this theory.

It is a truly beautiful rotation theory!
In future, it would be pleasure to create a rotational object based on your theory that I just learned.

I appreciate your continued support and encouragement.
Many thanks for your kindly advice for an immature animator.

Sincerely,
Freddy9638

Hello Maestral,

Fortunately my clock is running now smoothly!

I think that I was able to understand this theory now though I sacrificed much time in a white night !

Your advice was the super fastest jet.
And the key to solution was "0.0167" and O/C press Enter"
Now I know the meaning of "What went left in Albuquerque" !
This is beautiful and very useful theory for the rotation !

I thank for your continuous support and encouragement for an inexperienced animator.
I would like to express many thanks for all people who gave useful advice with kindness.

Thank you very much.

Yours sincerely,
Freddy9638

Hello hayasidist,

Thanks for information of "left at Albuquerque" !
Now I know the meaning of "What went left in Albuquerque" !
The reason is my work of "Hands on a watch".

Thanks Heyvern.
Luckily my clock is running now very smoothly!

I think that I was able to understand this theory now though I sacrificed much time in sleepless night !
This is a beautiful and very useful theory for the rotation !

For next, I would like to study the "aircraft propellor" rotation and the "windmill" rotation that I could see on your work. If you don't mind, would you please tell me any further information of them?

I thank for your continuous support and encouragement for an immatured animator.
I would like to express many thanks for all people who gave useful advice with kindness.

Thank you very much.

Yours sincerely,
Freddy9638,

Hi Freddy.

I'm away from base right now, so I don't have the actual AS files used to make the film, so this is what I think I did (it was also in AS8, so before the days of smart bones -- I might have done it differently if I'd have done this today..)



Windmill
----------

blades drawn on a vector layer.

simple layer rotation about the z axis here. *linear* interpolation, looped over whatever time interval, say frame 1 at 0 rotation to frame 150 at 360 then loop back to frame *2* (i.e. one frame after the "0 degree" key)

if the blades are not square on to camera then use y (and x if necessary) rotation; but that has to line up with the (2d) drawn perspective on the mill tower; and also needs to take into account the camera position and zoom settings (i.e. if you move the camera then the drawn perspective on the tower will also need to change)


====

Propeller
----------

the propeller on the plane in the video was done like this (and because the camera angle was not "square on", plus I wanted to give the "judder" effect, I felt it was it was easier to use this approach than to try to rotate the layer in 2 or 3 dimensions):

switch group
> static blades
> blades 1
> blades 2
> blades 3
> disc 1
> disc 2
> disc 3

the "static blades" vector layer was drawn in perspective with 3 blades (nominally 120 degrees apart)

the "blades" vectors were variations on the base "static blades" - I just pushed the points around to make 3 different views at about 0, 40, 80 degrees, adding blur and slightly shifting the gradient fill controls to give a "judder".

the "disc" vectors reduced to the blades to a blur; the key differences between them were the position of the strokes to give the effect of the blade leading edge and the position of the gradient fill controls.

In the timeline:

the standing plane used "static blade"

as the engine first starts I had a few manually keyed transitions on the blades such as 2, 3, static, 2, with varying intervals (about 3-4 frame interval), then 1,2,3 cycling for about 2 seconds or so at 3 then 2 then 1 frame intervals as the rotation speeds up, then manually keyed in a few "disc" vectors into the loop and finally a quasi random sequence of disc such as 1,2,3,2,1,3,1,2 at 1 frame intervals which I looped.

===

hope that helps!

Hello Hayasidist

I'm so sorry that my reply has been delayed.
I was in a trip of the summer vacation for a while.

I read your post on forum during my vacation.
I very appreciate your really detailed data of windmill and propeller.

My first windmill was pretty good according to your data.
I think that my windmill's rotary speed is probably a little bit fast than I expected, but it turns around well smoothly. I will fix for speed to turn a little bit slowly later.
I'm very happy with this result.

The propeller however is pretty difficult than my previous work such as windmill project.
Due to my immature understanding of ASP10, I am stuck at the first point of switch layer.

I read over your explanation repeatedly, but for better understanding, I seem to need a lot of time.
I would like to concentrate on your method till I could make a sense.

My first silly question is how many group of blades to be able to put in a one switch layer?
Can you put all three groups of Blades1,2 and 3 together in a one switch layer?
Or, are they assigned into a specific switch layer separately?

Or, as you kindly indicated as below, does your method require 7 switch layers separately ?

switch group
> static blades
> blades 1
> blades 2
> blades 3
> disc 1
> disc 2
> disc 3

I'm confused.
If you have any opportunity, please take your time and give it a right answer.
Even by "Yes or No" would be appreciated greatly.
-------------------------------------
Another difficulty is perspective drawing of the blades of propeller, but I'm expecting that only time is a solution for this problem.
So I wish that drawing of static blades would not have any problem.
-------------------------------------
P.S.
I visited your site and enjoyed your movie admiration.
Your movie is splendid! You did much work.
I wish you come back to work base with Anime Studio Pro10 heartily.

I thank for your advice heartily.

Sincerely,
Freddy9638

Freddy - hope you had a good vacation...
to answer your questions -

All seven vector layers are in one switch layer. I switch between these as previously described.

Static blades is all three blades in the "rest" position; blades 1 is all three blades but drawn rotated through (about) 40 degrees or so with respect to "static blades" but with some blur added on the trailing edge; blades 2 is like 1 but 80 degrees; blades 3 is like 1 but 120 degrees (i.e. back to more or less the "static" position). Similarly the "Disc" groups are just like the "blades" but take the blur to extremes.

yes they're all hand drawn to take into account perspective as they're not shown square on to camera; and yes - it is largely down to practice.

If you're interested in a challenge to get you started, try just square-on with your windmill (and forget blurs): if you have four blades (that are identical!) try making a set of vector layers with the blades "as drawn"; then that rotated by 30 degrees and 60 degrees. now put those three vector layers in a switch layer and switch between them in sequence (0, 30, 60, 0 ...) changing (say) every 10 frames ... then at (say) 5 frames and then at 1 frame. You'll probably think the animation looks "lumpy". So try adding a few extra vector layers at 15, 45, 75 and then cycle ( 0, 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, 0 ...) trying different frame rates... [I personally wouldn't use this approach for the "Square-on" view - I'd use either layer rotate or bone depending on the situation]

Hello Hayasidist

Thank you for kindly words. I enjoyed my summer trip very much.
and again thank you for quick reply and detailed data of the turn of propellers.

After having read your method, I have checked various movement of group 1 (Blade1.2.3), group 2 (Blade1.2.3), group3 (Blade1.2.3) and the switch layer and the static blade group respectively, though I am not sure if I have correctly assigned and treated them for the switch layer.
Of course I put all of them in one switch layer.

However, it is not obvious whether I have been working properly for weeks because their turn is very awkward.
Until when a result is given, I wish to upgrade this propellers turn better than ever.
So I would like to study your data and method as long as possible.

As my reference, I have been often visiting back to your site on Youtube for a beautiful seaplane movie. Propellers of your seaplane turn around very well. Particularly, a part of the approach run is splendid.
It is amazing and a great work.

It is my big dream to make the beautiful propeller turn such as your seaplane.

I appreciate your kindly advice heartily.

Sincerely,
Freddy9638

probably the easiest thing is if you upload your (AS file) propellor and I'll offer some comments on what to do to make it look better (and maybe also you'll get also comments from others following this thread).
(Just in case you're not sure about how to upload: you'll need to get an account on a file sharing site - usually free - e.g. https://www.dropbox.com/ - and then put the url to the file in your post. And if you did know that, then sorry to have reminded you!)

Hallo Hayasidist

Thank you for the information of dropbox.com.
Actually, I did not know the site that you told me.
I appreciate very useful suggestion of the dropbox site.

According to your proposal, I newly created my account of Dropbox.com.
Below is an url of my dropbox link.

--------------------------------------------
https://www.dropbox.com/home/Anime%20Studio%20Pro
--------------------------------------------

As you mentioned, I agree that is the best way and this means is fastest.

--------------------------------------------
Please take a look at it and I heartily wish that the work progresses if something may be useful.
With that in mind, please tell me your experimental useful advice.
--------------------------------------------

Unfortunately, as you can see, my rotary data are not beautiful at all. It is rather very poor.
It is awkward experimental turn that only arranged the rectangles of mere different colors.
Besides, it is a data of the progress on the way and very embarrassed.

Up to now, definitely this is a result of my propeller work,
however I want to get the better solution to this tough problem of the propeller rotate in near future.

--------------------------------------------
P.S.
I have been concentrated on other work for awhile.
Unfortunately I was not able to check this forum for weeks.
So it is a week ago that I read your post.
I apologize for this delay of my reply to your advice heartily.


Sincerely,
Freddy9638

freddy9638 wrote:Below is an url of my dropbox link.

--------------------------------------------
https://www.dropbox.com/home/Anime%20Studio%20Pro
--------------------------------------------

oops! that's your dropbox home page??!! you'll need to post the link to the file...

and no worries about how often you post here ... no apologies are necessary!

Hi hayasidist,

-----------------------------------------------
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z6k2w7eipjz9p ... .anme?dl=0
----------------------------------------------
this url has been edited

I just dropped a data file into the share holder of the dropbox.
The file name is "rectangles propeller.anime"
sorry, I'm really not sure how to do this.
Hope this works. if this url doesn't work again, please tell me. thanks.

freddy

ok... to get you off the starting blocks... if you open up each of the sub-layers in the switch and go to the menu: "animation / clear animation / from layer" that will get a better rotation.

then in the switch layer - delete all the S_blade keys (don't bother with these in the "1s")

and run the animation -- still a bit jerky so...

if you're feeling up to it:

grab all the keys to the right of a gap (use "click and drag" to "draw" a rectangle around the keys) and drag the keys to the left ... do this for the "big gap" animations)


and run the animation -- better!? .. but still not quite right so...


delete ALL the "1s" keys

replace the first set only with:

frame N+0 blade 1
frame N+1 blade 2
frame N+2 blade 3
frame N+3 blade 1 [edit: corrected the frame number!]

now right click on the key in N+3 and change it to be interpolation mode: CYCLE; then in the dialogue that pops up click the "relative" button and choose 2 as the number of frames to cycle back

and let it rip! stilll a few issues there, but hopefully by now you're getting the idea...

when you've done that, we'll move on to some finer points.

let me know how you get on.

Hi hayasidist,

Thank you for a quick reply and detailed data for turn of propeller.
Yes, I surely learned most by the kind advice of you and many people.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
https://www.dropbox.com/s/i1pyywm8793qf ... .anme?dl=0
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Above URL has been updated.

The above URL is the result of my rectangle propeller turn as an answer for your detailed data.

Instead of using the line of many frames, it became simpler and neater than a former method that I have done.
I love it.

An issue is that when the interpolation mode "cycle" is executed, one group of the blades seems like missing.

Therefore, the turn is awkward a little bit than that would be expected.
Eventually, I have struggled to fix it in various ways, but I couldn't do it in anyway.

Please tell me how to fix it, and how to improve the turn of a propeller.
Thanks for any advances,

Sincerely,
freddy

Hi hayasidist,

Please read these data.
-------------------------------------------
https://www.dropbox.com/s/q0m5mbkmfocyx ... .anme?dl=0
-------------------------------------------
I checked it after mailing in front once again.
Definitely I have done of wrong for previous "rectangle4"
interpolation mode: I made "relative" button of CYCLE 3 instead of CYCLE 2.
I'm not sure but I feel slightly good.
I just mail it.
Freddy