Moho Animation Forum

Just received the latest Content Paradise newsletter from SM - its all about how they are closing down CP and re-inventing it. Part of the remake is closing and removing the CP forums, and stopping access to downloads of existing purchased products.

The relevant bits from the newsletter:

Content Paradise will not be offering forums as part of our new online store. After May 28th, you will no longer be able to access threads and discussions, private messages or other information listed on our forums. If you require any of this information for future reference, please make sure to copy it prior to May 28th.

The product catalog is changing. This is the last day to make purchases in the current store. Please complete any purchases for the current catalog prior to this date. You will be able to access your downloads, order history, and wish list on the old site through July 1st, 2009. Due to the changes in the catalog, your order history and wish list will not be transferred to the new store. We will provide a long term method for looking at past order history (without download access).

I only see this as a further retrograde step by SM and their apparent disregard for their customer base. So if you want to access anything you had better do it ASAP.

I guess the upside of the forum closure is that there may well be more people using this forum for info on AS....

I'm interested to hear the inside scoop from DK.

I don't get it...

Content Paradise will not be offering forums as part of our new online store...

The product catalog is changing. This is the last day to make purchases in the current store...

I only see this as a further retrograde step by SM and their apparent disregard for their customer base.

What? Huh? Disregard for the customer?
They aren't getting rid of it they are making a NEW one. They are IMPROVING it obviously. You think a redesign of what was a very klunky and poorly designed site is a bad thing for customers? CP was a joike in my opinion. It was slow, hard to navigate and confusing. If they remaking it and do it right it should be an IMPROVEMENT.

The CP "forum" was also very badly done. There were no categories. Just "product" categories. All posts for AS were in one gigantic spot. The look of it was hard to read... light text on dark is bad. they've done studies.

No one posted there. I went in a few times. The posts were WEEKS apart.

Revamp it. Make it better. Can't wait to see it.

-vern

heyvern wrote:I don't get it...

[snip]

I only see this as a further retrograde step by SM and their apparent disregard for their customer base.

What? Huh? Disregard for the customer?
They aren't getting rid of it they are making a NEW one. They are IMPROVING it obviously. You think a redesign of what was a very klunky and poorly designed site is a bad thing for customers? CP was a joike in my opinion. It was slow, hard to navigate and confusing. If they remaking it and do it right it should be an IMPROVEMENT.

The CP "forum" was also very badly done. There were no categories. Just "product" categories. All posts for AS were in one gigantic spot. The look of it was hard to read... light text on dark is bad. they've done studies.

No one posted there. I went in a few times. The posts were WEEKS apart.

Revamp it. Make it better. Can't wait to see it.

-vern

Vern, I don't disagree about the poor quality of the forums, especially for AS. But they are getting rid of them entirely, not replacing them, and removing the ability to download purchases after 30 days. Which is good for SM, it will cut storage and server costs considerably.

Maybe you are right they should replace the existing CP site, but to remove any interactive forums, to me, is more about a company that doesn't know how, or want, to foster either a community or deal with issues in a public way.

Just my 2c...

P.S When was the last time we heard from Agent Smith?

P.P.S - I hope that this forum is completely independent of SM - otherwise I worry about its future, given their cost cutting attitude.

It has long been know that THIS forum is the MAIN forum for any real and timely discussions of AS. My hope is that by removing the utterly useless AS forum of CP (stuck in only because efrontier had AS on their product list) they will then focus on THIS forum as the source for AS discussion.

Problems with CP content are a customer/seller issue. They don't have anything to do with using AS. It seems to me the CP AS forum was for problems with purchased content. Just because they are removing that particular "forum" doesn't mean they won't replace it with something else.

I hope to have a CP store front eventually. CP isn't just for AS content. Remember they sell TEN TIMES more stuff for Poser. The CP site has been a klunker. Just looking through it was a NIGHTMARE for me even with a fast connection. It was not organized well. Navigation was confusing. A CP overhaul is LONG overdue. It's exciting news to me actually and I really look forward to it.

This news is GOOD. It means that SM is actually being proactive. Revamping a site like CP is NOT easy or cheap. It is not something you do when you are ignoring the customers or cutting corners. If they didn't care they would not change anything at all. It's cheaper to do nothing. It costs money and time to change a site like CP. If they are doing that then they are obviously not going to waste the effort. They wouldn't go through the hassle only to make it "worse" or leave it the same.

Keep in mind that the notice you received is not going to go into details about whatever it is they have planned. That's the idea behind PR stuff. They don't want it coming out in dribs and drabs... they want to pull the curtain back and show it off all at once.

I'm theorizing mind you. I have no clue.

-vern

Vern, I agree with you 100% that this is a good thing for CP as a storefront, no question at all.

On the issue of closing the forums though, we may have to agree to disagree. I wasn't just thinking of just the AS forum, but the bigger issue of closing down all of the official SM forums. There's a wealth of info on Poser on them that is a useful resource and which is the main focus of the content sold by SM.

To go to an email only means of communication with customers, will drive people to other venues - which is also great news for Daz3D, Renderosity etc. Who have far more active forums and, to be honest, a much greater sense of the value of the customer and how to support them.

So I do agree that it may be a good thing for AS and CP as a storefront. But overall, I think it is one more nail in the coffin of SmithMicro's support for their customers.

The problem I see is the assumption that there will be NO forum on the SM site. It could be that for whatever reason the old forum content could not be transferred to a "new" forum. Imagine the massive man hours required to change over something like that? A new company, with "new" products. They may want to start fresh.

CP had been around for a long time with efrontier. In that time store fronts and forum software have improved by leaps and bounds. There is no evidence that something like a new forum or customer support venue won't happen at a later date.

I am an eternal optimist. And... well... I'm right as often as I'm wrong. Whatever happens to CP we have no clue. You have a choice... assume the worst... or the best. The glass is half empty or it's half full. Without any clear info on the future plans for CP there is no way to know.

As for the loss of the forum content for Poser and other applications... if there is a "wealth" of info there I think SM is as aware of this as anyone. I would hope they wouldn't just chuck it. I think what I find annoying is that you assume that SM doesn't care about the customers. What evidence do you have for that conclusion? What has SM done since purchasing efrontier's product line that says they don't care about their customers?

Do you realize that SM doubled their product line? Not only doubled it but increased the complexity of that product line ten fold? They went from selling "widgets" to selling major full blown 3D and 2D animation and illustration packages. You can't make a transition like that over night. And then there is the economy to deal with. They HAVE to cut corners. Like many other companies.

Try not to assume the worst.

p.s. Take my comments with a grain of salt. When Bobby Mcferrin's song, "Don't Worry, Be Happy" came out years ago, I really liked it. I still do. All the pessimists around me wanted to vomit. Even Bobby Mcferrin himself hates that dang song. He was royally po'd when it became a hit.

-vern

Unfortunately, it seems they don't plan to have any new forums, the official word from the CP Product Manager is:

"Yes! CP is launching a new store on June 1st, and will be closing all the forums as of next Friday. Smith Micro does not have an official forum. The official way to communicate with Smith Micro staff is to submit your feedback directly.

Please don't worry about being heard by the teams! You can always communicate directly with the developers by submitting your feedback via the Smith Micro site. The developers were never active in interacting in the forums here, and feedback is gleamed from many places, not just this source, since not every user even uses online forums. The new CP store will have a place to submit feedback as well."

So I will try an not assume the worst, and try not to worry and be happy

Sorry. I hav'nt been watching the forum as closely in the last week so I missed this thread. The only thing can add is that I have already transferred my content to the new SM site without hassle and waiting to see what happens next. If there's anything specific you would like to know about any of this other than what dazza101 has found out let me know and I'll be happy to get some answers.

EDIT: One other thing.....there probably will be a few less products on the new CP site as all vendors have been asked to perform a cleanout. So if there's anything you particularly want to get hold of it might be a good idea to make it sooner rather than later.

Cheers
D.K

Is there any specific criteria for this "clean out", or are they just hoping to dump some of the products that just don't ever move?

My opinion of the CP content for AS specifically that... much of it was... well... I hate to be so blunt... but... uh... and saying this will put the pressure on me if I create content for CP... uh... the majority of it is crap. Slapped together junk just to have something to "sell" or re-purposed from Flash or Illustrator without any clean up. No thought as to whether it is usable or done right. No quality control. Having so much content that isn't vetted for quality and usability creates a feeling of distrust for ANY content on CP.

I wish they could put someone in charge who would say "This is not good enough". That is what Apple does with the iPhone store. People complain about Apple's "draconian" control over their store content but... it works. It maintains consistent and reliable quality of the products. Of course that job of reviewing all the content for CP could be 24/7.

p.s. If I offended anyone selling crap on CP... I am so sorry... but if you realize it might be crap then how could I have offended you?

-vern

I totally agree, Vern. Great stuff is lost in that sea of mediocrity (mediocrity being kind). And don't get me started on some of the pricing. I think they really need a customer rating system for the products. If the product isn't what you expected, then rate it such and others will be able to avoid it.

Eventually this (with the number of votes in and the approval rating) would establish the good providers.

I'm not allowed to say much due to the NDA but culling products that aren't selling well or old is a good idea in any product based business. I think they are pushing for a fresh new look and feel to the whole thing.

Cheers
D.K

I guess my initial reaction to anything bad about the changes to CP goes like this...

"Hey! I'm getting a makeover next week!"
"WHAT!? I like you just the way your are!"
"Yeah but I need a new look. I think a new style would look better."
"I don't want you to change. If you change I won't recognize you!"
"Self improvement. New hair cut, some new clothes, maybe join a gym..."
"I can't believe you would abandon your friends like this."
"I'm painting my house after that. I hope you..."
"PAINTING YOUR HOUSE!?!?!? OH MY GOD! NOOOOO...."

Tongue firmly in cheek.

-vern

heyvern wrote:The CP "forum" was also very badly done. There were no categories. Just "product" categories. All posts for AS were in one gigantic spot.
-vern

Exactly like the way the CG Talk or Renderosity forums are set-up.