Moho Forum

Ok, I am building some characters for animateing in AS and I have some questions.

Vectors or Pixels? For AS is there an advantage to using one over the other? I am using all vectors right now because I am taking on a fairly large project by myself and I am trying to save time where ever I can. I want to build this whole thing in AS. I notice that Windsor seems to be mostly pixel.

Layers. Right now I have specific parts of the face that I am working on in different layers. For example, iris, pupils, whites, lids, highlights and shadows are all on there own individual layers. I have it set up this way to make it easier for me to work with. Is there a benefit to keeping this setup or should I condense my parts to single layers?

Previews and Renders. Is there a way to get bigger renders or a more acurate previews in AS?

Color and Texture and Depth. I am thinking about mood and color here. Does anybody have any recomendations for how to get deep moody colors and textures in AS? My colors always come out very flat and primary looking.

Highlites and Shadows. Any good ways to get highlites and shadows on skin? Layers?

This is all I can think of for now. Any input at all would be great! Thanks!

For me its funny to take some of my old cartoons and animate them, without a new drawing, allright, not much new drawings...
That's what I like in AS if I'm working with bitmaps.

Vector makes also fun, but I have always to look what has to be in the back or in the foreground.
If I import an illustrator file I can't change it, only with "cut out" and "paste", sounds easy but it isn't.
The same problem is for me if I'm creating a vector art in AS.
Or have I to create always a new layer, one for a leg, one for an arm?
Lazyness seems to be very fast punished.

I'm working with Corel Draw, with the object manager I can change it very fast, such kind of tool would be nice in AS, (yes, exist, but not with this special comfort in vector art... only if I'm importing different png's it's possible for me.)

A hobbyist's responses, hopefully you'll find something useful in them and maybe get some more professional opinions soon.

tomfommber wrote:Vectors or Pixels? For AS is there an advantage to using one over the other? I am using all vectors right now because I am taking on a fairly large project by myself and I am trying to save time where ever I can. I want to build this whole thing in AS. I notice that Windsor seems to be mostly pixel.

I'd say vectors - they are more flexible for rigging, easier to tweak both at modelling and animation stages, and better for close-ups. I think the joints (elbows and knees) are easier to set up on vectors too.
I suspect it's more of a personal style choice.

tomfommber wrote:Layers. Right now I have specific parts of the face that I am working on in different layers. For example, iris, pupils, whites, lids, highlights and shadows are all on there own individual layers. I have it set up this way to make it easier for me to work with. Is there a benefit to keeping this setup or should I condense my parts to single layers?

If you find it easier to work that way, do it. The only problem I can foresee immediately is ending up with way too many layers to scroll through comfortably, particularly as you get into multiple characters in a scene.

Some multiplicity of layers can be required for masking.

Vern, one of the forum's most expert riggers, has stated his preference for a condensed hierarchy of vector layers.

One possibility: Once you've finished modelling, condense everthing that doesn't need to be in separate layers for animation or masking. You may find it easier to handle fewer layers when it comes to animation.

tomfommber wrote:Previews and Renders. Is there a way to get bigger renders or a more acurate previews in AS?

The still-frame render size relies on the project dimensions (File, Project Settings, Dimensions).

tomfommber wrote:Color and Texture and Depth. I am thinking about mood and color here. Does anybody have any recomendations for how to get deep moody colors and textures in AS? My colors always come out very flat and primary looking.

Textures are where you might definitely consider bitmap-based characters, or at least backgrounds.
However, see Tutorial 4.4 for image textures on a vector layer.

Colour - set your palette first - you can cheat by using a frame-grab or an image from some other work that you feel has the right mood, and setting that as your swatch image, or you can use colour theory and art books to select your colours. Examine animation work you think has the right mood for the amount of character detail they use to get that atmosphere.

Some advice that I remember reading that may apply: just because you've spent a lot of time on your character, don't feel you then have to show them full-length and fully-lit. Hide them in the shadows, show only parts of the character (even only parts of the face), show them (or the parts of them that are on-screen) in silhouette or only with rim lighting. Let the camera only catch brief poorly-lit glimpses of the character.

tomfommber wrote:Highlites and Shadows. Any good ways to get highlites and shadows on skin? Layers?

Soft edges or blurred layers and semi-transparent colours?
Although I haven't yet really used it myself extensively, the use of shapes with layer blending modes might be useful, although it will potentially mean more layers.

Regards, Myles.

Many layers for a face or body is not really a problem unless you plan to use point motion instead of bone rigging.

Think about it this way:

If you create many shapes on one layer... that is the same as many shapes on different layers. It may not look as nice but it will animate the same way. the bones work the same. If you collapse the bone folder you never have to look at all the layers.

Plus you can turn off layers to easily work on small parts without all the clutter. You can also layer highlights and shadows very easily and use "ink effects" on the layers. For example a custom layer with white and black shapes or effects could be set for multiply to create shadows, or screen to create just highlights. This isn't always as easily done on one shape layer. You can achiever very subtle effects this way.

Another benefit of separate layers for shapes; Animating the order. There is no built in way to animate the order of shapes on one layer. There is no easy way to use scripting to order "shapes" in one layer either (it is hard not impossible).

There is however the very simple trick of using a layers translation in the Z direction to "fake" a change in order. So you could turn a head and if the ears are on separate layers you can change their order by changing their z-depth. If you have arms and legs on separate layers you can "flip" them as well.

I use to "flatten" all my layers to one layer... until I realize it was a lot of effort for no particular gain except to make the file "look nice".

My characters usually end up with bunches of layers... ears, eyes, mouth, nose, hair, etc etc. At a miniumum ears and eyes specifically on their own layer. Eyes for masking.

It is SOOOOOO hard to select a point in the middle of bunches and bunches of points.

If you plan to use point motion for animation using many layers will be a nightmare. You would have to constantly switch layers to edit and produce the key frames. You will spend more time hunting around for the right layer and finding the right spot for key frames than animating.

-vern

Thanks so much to each of you! Your answers will be tons of help.

I do have one question regarding the responses.

Myles, you suggested that I "set your palette first - you can cheat by using a frame-grab or an image from some other work that you feel has the right mood, and setting that as your swatch image" this seems like a great idea but how do I do it? Set the swatch I mean.

how do I do it? Set the swatch I mean.

From the built in help:

Finally, at the bottom of the Style window is a set of color swatches. You can use these as a shortcut for selecting colors for your objects. Just click a color in this palette to assign it as the selected shape's fill color. Right-click a color swatch to assign it as the selected shape's outline color.

The "Swatches" popup menu lets you select from different sets of color swatches. These color swatches are just image files stored in a folder called "swatches". You can add your own image files to this folder, and they will appear in the Swatches popup menu the next time you start Anime Studio. Or, you can select "Custom Image..." from the popup menu and Anime Studio will prompt you to select an image file to use.

Just a a random thought: Seeing Fenkoto's character (created in Flash) makes me think gradients might be useful to you for adding some mood and avoiding some of that flatness you were talking about.

Regards, Myles.