Possible issue with animated layer order?

[Mattyj]

Hey there I believe I am just having some issues with animated layer orders.

I am attempting to bring a vector layer (Indeelift remote in image above) into my rigged hand group layer above the palm layer but below the fingers and thumb tip layer. When I do so, the indeelift remote immediately is moved from its spot hanging up on the Indeelift handle (see image above) to somewhere in the top left of frame.

I feel like this could be something to do with the point of origin changing for the Indeelift once it is moved into the hand group but could be wrong.

Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks

[Greenlaw]

Hi Mattyj,

You need to use the Dropbox cloud link to make the images show up in the post; you can't use your local computer directory path. To get the Dropbox link, right click on the file and choose Copy Dropbox Link. You can do this directly from your computer or from the DB website. After pasting the Dropbox link, you also need to change dl=0 to raw=1.

Will comment when I can see the pics.

[Greenlaw]

Yay! The images just appeared!

[synthsin75]

If the hand group have been moved, anything you put in that group will also be moved.

[Mattyj]

If the hand group have been moved, anything you put in that group will also be moved.

Is there any way to move a layer to within a group layer without it moving from its original position?

[synthsin75]

No. The best you could do is realign it once it's in the group.

[Mattyj]

All good just the palm out of the hand group, then just moved the remote above it, but below the hand group, and it worked

[Greenlaw]

I would bind the remote device to the hand bone with no keyframes. This will keep the device locked to the hand.

For stacking order, I would drag it out of the thumb group layer and place it in the hand group. This way, you can insert the remote layer above the palm and between any of the finger (group) layers as you wish.

I'm not sure you need to enable Animated Layer Order for this animation but if you do, you should use it on the Hand group, not for each finger group. But it depends on what you're trying to do of course.

If the device is supposed to leave the hand at some point, I would create a duplicate layer that's not bound to the hand bone, and switch the visibility between the two layers. Layer Bind the duplicate layer to its own free-floating bone, and animate that to move the remote away from the hand. This way, the character's hand motions won't interfere with the remote's motion. Alternatively, you can use the Parent Bone tool to unparent the remote's bone, but I personally find it easier to switch visibility to another layer that's already unparented.

Hope this helps.

[Mattyj]

Fantastic ty for the tips greenlaw

[Mattyj]

Hey Greenlaw, so I bound the remote to the hand bone, and placed it in the hand group, but the remote moves with the hand now? so as the hand moves up to grasp it, the remote moves also at the same pace into the upper left of frame.

[Mattyj]

I basically want the hand to come up, grasp the remote and then remove it from the handles of the main device (in images above)

[Greenlaw]

Just re-quoting from the above post...

If the device is supposed to leave the hand at some point, I would create a duplicate layer that's not bound to the hand bone, and switch the visibility between the two layers. Layer Bind the duplicate layer to its own free-floating bone, and animate that to move the remote away from the hand. This way, the character's hand motions won't interfere with the remote's motion. Alternatively, you can use the Parent Bone tool to unparent the remote's bone, but I personally find it easier to switch visibility to another layer that's already unparented.

Basically, it's all about hierarchy and sleight of hand. Here's the info with more specific directions...

1. You have two duplicate remote layers, one inside the hand group, one outside.
2. The outside remote layer can be in the character's bone group but it gets its own bone that's not parented to anything. Also, the the bone strength to zero and use Layer Binding. This way the remote is only affected by this bone and the bone does not affect anything else in the character.
3. Animate this bone to make the remove fall from the sky.
4. When the remote is in position with the hand, keyframe the layer visibility to make is invisible.
5. Keyframe the layer visibility of the one in the hand to visible. If the remotes are lined up, it will look one remove.

This is basically how the chip appears to move from the bowl, to the hand, into the mouth, and back into the bowl in this demo...

https://lostmarble.com/forum/viewtopic. ... 0#p202960

In your project, do the same for your remote.

Another way to do this is to place the art in the hand where you want it, and Layer Bind it to a free-floating bone as described above. Animate this falling into position and at the frame where you want it locked to the hand bone, use the Parent Tools to attach it to the hand bone. This will create a keyframe for the reparenting.

Note that the second method may seem more direct but it can get messy to edit if you're still animating the character. I usually prefer the first method because it's a more predictable, but they both work.

Good luck!

[Mattyj]

Awesome Greenlaw will give it a go today, ty very much for your time and advice.