Lip Sync - New Interesting Way

[BrianLucas]

This guy made a new, interesting way to Lip Sync.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpNB2OZvsy0&t=1034s

But, I can't make it work for me. If I go from, let's say L to O, It doesn't jump right L to O without also adding all keyframe of letters in between them.

[Greenlaw]

I'm guessing you're not using step keys for your Smart Bone Dial in the timeline. If you don't do that, the switch or shape animation will move through the poses sequentially. But if you use Step keys for the SBD, the key will hold the pose until the next keyframe.

[BrianLucas]

Oh... That seems to be the problem then. Thanks

[Greenlaw]

Sure. Also, if you're not already doing this, be sure to set your Default Interpolation to Copy Previous Key. This way you won't have to keep changing interpolation modes between different items and layers...Moho just uses whichever mode that was used for the previous key on that channel. (This is the same keyframing behavior found in After Effects.)

Hope this helps.

[BrianLucas]

Thank you so much!

[BrianLucas]

It works with step keys. The negative part about this way is that the mouth shapes don't interpolate. I think I'll go back to switch layer.

[Greenlaw]

Yes, that's because you need to keyframe the switch layer directly for this, not through an Action which is technically always playing the animation linearly. (Using Step on the SBD is a way around this but the animation inside the Action is still linear regardless.) This is why I recommend using the Switch Selection window as described here:

https://www.lostmarble.com/forum/viewto ... 19#p208919

There are other ways to control the Switch Layer and still get interpolation between layers and groups, but using the Switch Selection window is the easiest and most direct method. You can streamline setup this further using by using the Layer Shortcuts script or Layer Selection Buttons script to select the Switch layer to load it into the Switch Selection windows.

You can also use Shift+Alt and click on the artwork to load the artwork's Switch layer into the Switch Selection window, but this only works if you don't use Groups inside your Switch layer. (Unfortunately, I always use groups inside the mouth Switch layer. I'm hoping a future Moho gets a native way to select layers using custom on-screen 'buttons' like Layer Shortcuts does.)

Hope this helps.

[Obada]

Hello,
I'm trying to do this but with switch layers and with layer interpolation On but couldn't get it to work perfectly, I'm placing anchor points perfectly and everything is being placed as it should but I'm still getting jumps in frames (key frame and the one before).

Something I've noticed and am not sure about is that it's happening when essentially there are many switch layers (or groups), and not when I have no more than a 3-4 groups for the poses.

I've tried this a couple times and I couldn't get it to work as it should.

Thanks,
Obada

[Greenlaw]

Something I've noticed and am not sure about is that it's happening when essentially there are many switch layers (or groups), and not when I have no more than a 3-4 groups for the poses.

What type of interpolation are you using for the Switch keys? For animating a Switch layer with interpolation enabled, you should use Smooth or Linear. Also make sure you have Interpolate Sublayers enabled.

Earlier I mentioned using Step keys but that tip was not meant for getting interpolation in a Switch layer; it was for getting non-linear animation in a Switch layer using a Smart Bone Dial. If you're not using an SBD, you can ignore that tip because Switch layers can be animated non-linearly using Smooth or Linear when keyframed directly or through the Switch Selection Window.

Finally, remember that you need to maintain the number of points in the artwork and their point order for the morphing effect to be possible. To do this, you need to base all your drawings on the same original shape. This requires planning--for example, make a sketch for each of the mouth shapes you will be morphing between so you can determine a suitable number of points in the base shape that you will use to create the mouth shapes for the Switch layer. If you break the point order in a layer, you will no longer be able to use it for interpolation. In this situation, it's easiest to duplicate a layer that looks similar and modify that as a replacement.

Hope this helps.

[Obada]

Thanks for the reply, I checked all of the points you said and everything should have been correct, but I managed to solve the problem by creating reference layers (what a feature!) to correct where the initial layer animation goes wrong at.

I know I haven't "solved" the issue which I'm still wondering why it was happening, but I still managed to find a workaround which covered it at least lol.

[Greenlaw]

...I managed to solve the problem by creating reference layers (what a feature!) to correct where the initial layer animation goes wrong at.

This reminded me of a mouth setup I created in Moho last year for animating a 2D mouth for a 3D character. The result kinda resembled what I did for Happy Box many years earlier but the recent setup is more sophisticated and animated smoothly.

The mouth rig used three separate switches for L/C/R views, with a parent switch layer to switch between these views. I didn't use Reference layers for the mouths shapes, I used Duplicates of a base mouth shape instead because in this situation Interpolation worked more reliably with Duplicates. But inside each drawing group I did use a Reference layer of a mesh warp that could modify the expression of the mouth shape using a Smart Bone Dial. This worked very well because it meant I could adjust this mesh warp for every mouth shape inside all three switches (42 mouth shapes in total) all from a single mesh layer, to create many more mouth pose variations 'on-the-fly' during animation.

The result looked very good on the 3D character, much better than what I did for Happy Box. FYI, I used Magpie Pro for Happy Box which could only do hard switching between drawings, so no interpolation. At the time, I liked the 'robot chicken' effect but if I was making Happy Box nowadays, I'd definitely use this smoother Moho-based method.

For obvious reasons I can't share the Moho project file but maybe I can create a generic interpretation for a tutorial later.

[Obada]

I guess there are a ton of ways to do switches for mouth poses. I’m still learning Moho (sorry if I didn’t understand some of what you mentioned) and rigging this character had me tiring, especially the mouth so now I got some ideas from what you mentioned like using a switch between L,C,R body poses instead of interpolating the animation between them which I can see how complex it can be.
You just can’t get enough ways to do what you want in animation I think. Lots to see in my way .

Thank you.

[Greenlaw]

I guess there are a ton of ways to do switches for mouth poses...

That's certainly true! Depending on the character design (and the time I was making the rig,) I might have used any of dozens of different techniques. Moho's flexibility is one of its strengths. But knowing which approach is best for a given situation usually comes from practice and experience.

Nowadays, my typical Moho character rig has the mouth Switch layer parented to a Mouth bone parented to a Face bone that's parented to the Head Bone. Then when I'm using a Smart Bone for a head turn, I just slide the Face bone left or right. In the same Smart Bone Action, and I might reshape the front pose mouth drawings for 3qtr views...sometimes this is done by directly moving the points or layers or by using a Mesh Warp layer in the Action. For head tilts I like to use another Smart Bone to move that face bone up and down and make perspective adjustments directly to the head artwork. The Boss Baby: Back In Business Moho rigs I created were all done this way.

[djoly]

For obvious reasons I can't share the Moho project file but maybe I can create a generic interpretation for a tutorial later.

I’d love to see a generic set up like this in a tutorial, if you ever get a chance. The past tutorials I've seen of yours are terrific.