resetting Origin

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:04 pm

I'd like to make a face similar to the example in C:\Program Files\e frontier\Anime Studio Pro\Library\User Movies\Squeaky_10sec.moho.

I've moved the face forward on the Z-axis (using Translate layer + alt key), but the point of origin comes with it. Is there a way to move the the layer forward but not the point of origin?

JCook · Post by **JCook** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 1:06 pm

The only thing I can think of is to select the points and move them forward, instead of the layer. Or, scale them and make them look like they are moving forward. If you do anything with a layer, I think the point of origin is affected no matter what.

Jack

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 3:59 pm

JCook wrote:The only thing I can think of is to select the points and move them forward...

Thanks Jack. I gave that a try but when selecting the points with any Draw tools won't move the points forward. And you're right, the trick seems to be isolating the vertices from the point of origin.

rplate · Post by **rplate** » Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:30 pm

Gnaws wrote:I'd like to make a face similar to the example in C:\Program Files\e frontier\Anime Studio Pro\Library\User Movies\Squeaky_10sec.moho.

I've moved the face forward on the Z-axis (using Translate layer + alt key), but the point of origin comes with it. Is there a way to move the the layer forward but not the point of origin?

Looking at the timeline and scrolling down to the camera and when the face moves up it seems to be a camera zoom.

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 3:54 am

...it seems to be a camera zoom.

If you use the Orbit tool and look straight down at the face, you'll see that the face vertices are moved out from the point of origin.

This problem is a pesky bugger, no? I played around with it some more today and still can't figure how he did it.

JCook · Post by **JCook** » Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:32 pm

You could try switching to a top-down view and moving the points forward. Select the points in the normal view, then switch to the top view (>View>Direction>Top) and move the points, then go back to the normal view. Alternatively you could split the screen using the little icons at the bottom, make one the camera view and the other the top view, and work that way. Then you should be able to see the results as you work. You would probably want to switch back to the one panel camera view for rendering.

Jack

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 3:33 am

Still no play, Bro.

I had to break down and call e-frontier tech support. They don't know how to do it either. They're forwarding the issue on to AS Engineering.

-g

rplate · Post by **rplate** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 6:46 pm

If you use the Orbit tool and look straight down at the face, you'll see that the face vertices are moved out from the point of origin.

Z depth movie here
I created a tutorial as such, to explain how I see how it was done.
The Z depth was inserted on the zero key frame manually for the
depth of the various parts of the onion face.
If you change the Z depth to 0 while looking at the orbit tool you will
notice that the various parts align with the depth of the onion face.
I hope this sheds some light on how this was done. Hope it helps.

PS: I can't leave this movie on my server for long so in due time I will have to remove the link.

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:27 pm

rplate - that was nice of you to put this up, however...

All components would have different z coords.

If you manually type in a Z-axis coordinate, sure it will move, but so will (in this instance) the entire face.

What I'd like to know is how to move the z-axis back away from their respective vertices. Just the z-axis....not the face.

Thanks again.

-g

rplate · Post by **rplate** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:04 pm

Gnaws wrote:rplate - that was nice of you to put this up, however...
All components would have different z coords.
If you manually type in a Z-axis coordinate, sure it will move, but so will (in this instance) the entire face.
What I'd like to know is how to move the z-axis back away from their respective vertices. Just the z-axis....not the face.
Thanks again.

-g

Question... What is it exactly, that makes you think the Z axis is set apart from the onion face in the sample you sited?

In the sample you were referring to ie, the Onion face, the face is separate from the eyes, mouth etc. they are each on different Z axis planes.
That's what gives the the 3D effect when the head turns. I'm not quite understanding what it is you are trying to do I guess. Sorry

But thanks for the response back.
I hope, IF it gets resolved you will let us know how.
Does this forum link shed any light on it?
http://www.lostmarble.com/forum/viewtop ... g+drinking
It's a 3D dog with its parts on different Z axis planes in conjunction with facing the camera view.

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:21 pm

If you look from the top view you can clearly see the point of rotation is behind the object.

If/when I find out, I'll definitely share it with everyone.

Does this forum link shed any light on it?
http://www.lostmarble.com/forum/viewtop ... g+drinking

At first I thought it had something to do with "facing the camera", etc. But in this example I'm trying to reverse-engineer, there isn't any of that.

rplate · Post by **rplate** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 10:22 pm

The face rotation folder is a group folder. The Z axis is set at 0
Inside the group folder are the parts of the face with the Z axis set with a positive axis number.
I changed those to a negative by adding a minus in front of the given Z axis settings for those parts. As you can see the minus put the face behind the face rotation group layer Z axis

When you use the layer rotation tool with the face rotation folder hi lited the parts of the face rotate. The Onion head does not move at all. It's an illusion because the head is round. It never moves except back and forth with the bones.
Am I getting close to what you are looking for?

Touched · Post by **Touched** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 10:25 pm

Very simple. The point of rotation you have selected is for the group folder that contains the face. The face layers inside the group are the ones that are translated in the Z axis. The group is not. I just tested this out on a new file, and got the same results you illustrate here.

EDIT: Rplate beat me to it. ^^

Gnaws · Post by **Gnaws** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:36 am

rplate wrote:The Z axis is set at 0
Inside the group folder are the parts of the face with the Z axis set with a positive axis number.
I changed those to a negative by adding a minus in front of the given Z axis settings for those parts. As you can see the minus put the face behind the face rotation group layer Z axis

First of all rplate, thank you SO much for giving this so much of your time and consideration. I really appreciate it, Brother.

However....the Point of Origin (let's just call it POO) is *relative* to its group. Sure you can move its coords, but the entire group move (relatively) with it.

What I can't figure is how they determined that *relative POO* to begin with.

If you drag the "face rotation" layer up to the very top (no parent...out of the group), you'll see that the POO is still behind the face. Apparently its POO not pre-determined by the parent.

=\

Touched · Post by **Touched** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:44 am

The point of origin is the group layer called "face rotation" itself. The layers contained within that group have the Z depth outward from that origin.

resetting Origin

resetting Origin

Re: resetting Origin